There seems to be a lot of emotive opinion and speculation of the downsides of prong collars. In my experience, from people who have never actually seen one, let alone actually put one round their own neck and given it a tug…!!!!!

I’ve seen a rotweiler with a harness pull a 16 stone man off his feet. I’ve seen a nose collar rub off fur on several dogs, cause callus on a couple and even cut into a dogs nose on one. I’ve also seen owners pay fortunes on dog training and still break down in tears because their dog is unmanagable. Don’t insult me with the “ah, well, with the right training…” argument, some dogs will not walk a lead nicely with treat (i.e smoke and mirrors) training until the day they die.

A prong collar is a tool, nothing more. It’s use is effective, safe, gentle and can offer instant results.

Considering a dog won’t pull against a prong collar used properly, how is it causing pain? The collars have rounded prongs, it’s like trying to puncture the skin with the blunt end of a pencil.

Personally, I love my dog and wouldn’t see her harmed. I also own and use a prong collar daily and have a healthy, happy dog. After a few thousand £ of training with 4 different trainers, hundreds spent on treats, clickers, harnesses, halti’s with no improvements on waling a leash, I cannot recommend the effectiveness and low physical impact of a prong collar highly enough. Just the sheer erradication in stress for both of us before and during a walk has made using a prong collar invaluable.

I personally give hearsay, speculation and uninformed opinion absolutely no attention. You show me your own dog with a neck ripped open by a prong collar and I’ll stop using and recommending them, until then, I have one, you don’t, and your speculation on it’s effect means nothing. Pretty simple when you think about it.

Thanks for barking in. You’ve done an excellent job of explaining this side of prong collars and given us all something to think about.

With devices such as prongs, as in all training devices, you need to go in the same order. Too many people are quick to skip to level 3 without going through levels 1 and 2. They just throw one on a dog like a ignorant parent might hand the keys over to an adolescent with no driving experience.

Prior to training a dog with a prong collar, you have to teach it the basics: you do so mainly by showing the dog what to do rather than what not to do: “this is how you start the ignition, this is how you go forward, this is how you stop, make turns, etc.–> This is how you sit, this is how you walk, etc.” You do a lot of explaining, which in the dog world, means either cueing the dog, or if the dog offers it before you even cue it, rewarding/reinforcing it a la clicker training/ operant conditioning. At this point the only time you ever need to teach the dog the concept of consequence is to show that the dog will not get what it wants (such as a treat or a favorite toy) until he’s successful in performing the desired behavior. You start all this stuff in a distraction free environment– you don’t even need to “start the car” to begin to show someone the basic means of how to drive it.

Step two, you drive the car in a safe space. Let the dog experiment with what it learned, and reinforce good behavior. Before you know it, your driver (the dog) will feel good that s/he’s driving well and will not even need extra reinforcement. You can alter your rate of reinforcement until it is totally phased out– the dog is just feeling good about being a good driver. You can even start driving in quiet neighborhoods and very gradually work your way up to the loud, noisy highways.

Step three: you put your car/your dog in the real world (where rewards are not usually readily available) and start letting HIM make the choices without (his knowledge of) your guidance.

** note some people avoid this step altogether by being a constant passenger in the dog’ s car and managing the driving, such as using a gentle leader, sense-ation harness, etc.– which is perfectly OK if you don’t mind that the dog is only driving properly because YOU are there to ensure that he does.**

This is the world of interesting smells, interesting dogs, scary things, yummy things, and poisonous things– a very environmentally rewarding world with which your own treats and praise may not be able to compete. Your dog may or may not need your guidance, but SOME dogs may mistakenly think it’s ok to drive at 95 mph. At this point you need your dog to understand that doing such things can result in a consequence. The key is that you have to have the dog understand that it his his/her choice, and not you (the handler), that led to this consequence. If the dog pulls on the lead, just as if someone is speeding in the car, the dog has to learn that it is more likely to lead to a consequence such as a pinch. Likewise if the dog is constantly garbage-mouthing the ground– for its own good (the sake of not getting sick) you better provide an alternate, more obvious consequence. Better a speeding ticket than a traffic accident!

The idea is to eventually transform “positive punishment**” (the pinch) into negative reinforcement (the lack of pinch due to good behavior) coupled with positive reinforcement (the treat) when the dog thinks first, and then makes the appropriate choice. (** See wikipedia for more information on these terms).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforcement

It shouldn’t take more than a few speeding tickets (at an appropriately high amount– a $5 speeding ticket ain’t gonna change anything!) to get the dog to stop being a reckless driver, and then a few treats afterwards to reinforce safe driving on the dog training roads.

Happy driving!

Yes, I know that a regular buckle collar can do damage, but the fact of the matter is, these tools are being used in lieu of training. I hear people stating that they only use the prong for walks, well — your dog isn’t trained to walk well on leash. If your dog is NOT trained, then it is going to hurt themselves, especially when using a device that’s primary design feature is to cause discomfort in order to make the animal comply. Yes, they are effective, yes it would be a good option for a person who may not be physically able to control a dog in the preliminary time of training. But the prong should ONLY be used in special circumstances, should be fitted correctly, and should be used with the intention of phasing it out permanently once the dog is trained.

Amber